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The Siege Of Minas Tirith  by Morwen Tindomerel 2 Review(s)
Raksha The DemonReviewed Chapter: 23 on 7/13/2004


I'm not going to share Idril's belief that Faramir was responsible for his father's death. The only thing Faramir should feel guilty for perhaps is the loss of his men on an ill-advised mission; and for that loss Denethor is also responsible.

<"I told you didn't I?" she said to the unconscious
Man. "I hope you're satisfied, Brother. You may have
ruined us all!">

Castigating an unconscious man for following his father's orders seems to go beyond even the premise of conveying an 'I told you so' to him. Idril seems to me to have inherited Denethor's bitterness although she is not his blood.

If Idril's premise is that Faramir was responsible for his father's madness and death because he put himself in a situation where he was likely to be injured or killed and so send Denethor off the edge, then Denethor was already pretty far gone. Everyone in Minas Tirith had a pretty low life expectancy at the time Faramir left for Osgiliath, and if Faramir had held himself back from all danger so as to protect his father, he would have been cowardly and a poor example to the rest of the City, where there were plenty of other young soldiers in harm's way who might also have had worried, aged fathers.

I am not sure whether you're trying to say that you believe Faramir caused his father's death and are using Idril to express the viewpoint in the story, or that Idril believes it. If Idril does succeed in pushing Faramir to say that she was right, then he's an even weaker man than the movie-version seems to be. Denethor chose his own death. Plenty of other people in Minas Tirith lost loved ones, believed hope was lost, but did not abandon their responsibilities. If I had been in Faramir's position, I would not have judged Denethor totally incompetent/verging on madness when he gave the order to retake Osgiliath, just wrong. And a Captain in Faramir's position could not refuse such an order just because he disagreed with its merit. In any case, I'm not going to agree with Idril, and find her insistance in the matter rather vicious and ultimately quite sad.

I am enjoying all other elements of the story, especially Pippin's role, and look forward to future updates.

Author Reply: Opinions expressed by characters in my stories do not necessarily reflect those of the author ;D

Idril *is* bitter during the siege, in her eyes her menfolk are failing both her and their City in its hour of need. This may not be a reasonable pov, but an understandable one.

There were good arguments for the attack on Osgilliath, as Faramir points out in his conversation with his sister. There were also some damn good arguments against, as Idril says. Basically she she turned out to be right because the Orcs used a new tactic, massed bows, which nobody expected. It could have gone the other way.

Idril thinks Faramir should have stood up to Denethor and not only refused to lead the attack but refused to allow it to be made. For the sake of the two thousand Men as well as D's sanity. She may have an unrealistic idea of what military discipline would allow, however she does claim that Boromir would have done so - and presumably had seen him argue their father into better strategy on other occasions. And my reading of the book's council of war suggests that the council could have legally overruled the Steward but didn't. It should also be said that Denethor apparently comes to agree with Idril's opinion when he blames himself for sending his son into needless peril. Never the less, as I said the whole issue is very iffy - as issues of strategy in war usually are.

Denethor's sanity *is* fragile, as he proves in both book and movie by his reaction to Faramir's apparently mortal wound, and his daughter knows it. But in all justice to D his shattering grief for Boromir's death and what he sees in the Palantir are major contributing factors. He could probably have delt with any two of these traumas but all three were too much for him.

Maybe Idril is being mean and unreasonable, or at least overly harsh. But that's the way she feels and Faramir is going to have to deal with. And he will, never fear, he knows very well how to get the better of his sister.

Thank you for caring enough about the story to comment at such length and with such vigor. And feel free to disapprove of Idril - she certainly isn't what I'd call likeable!

Raksha The DemonReviewed Chapter: 23 on 7/6/2004
An excellent and riveting story. You've done a great job of investing Arwen with a strong character and credible history.

I find myself both admiring Idril and being repelled by her; she reminds me quite a bit of Denethor as he must have been in his youth; strong, honorable, and intolerant of the failings of others. I wonder if she will reconcile with Faramir; she seems determined to blame him for their father's death. She had said that if Faramir got himself killed, his death would destroy Denethor - and she was right; but I don't think it is fair to blame Faramir for it. He could hardly have sat out the Siege hiding himself away from danger to save his fragile father's sanity; everyone in Minas Tirith faced death, the Captains (such as Faramir) had the greatest duty and the greatest risk of danger. It was not Faramir's idea to retake Osgiliath, and he did protest, but Denethor insisted; I doubt that Faramir could have dissuaded him, and he did not want to be thought a coward. Faramir was trying, despite his own considerable sorrow, to be the son that Denethor wanted, as well as a loyal Captain. He was not spineless, he had already broken Denethor's command to slay all intruders in Ithilien, and released the Ringbearer although he knew (in the movieverse) that his father wanted the Ring. Denethor himself, with some assistance from Sauron via the Palantir that Denethor chose to look into, was responsible for his own death and the attempt to kill his son.

Idril does not seem particularly happy that Faramir is alive and well; in this chapter she seems determined to punish him. She should either have it out with Faramir, forgive him, or leave him alone.

I liked Faramir's recognition of the harm that Denethor did, though I think it was not deliberate, to Pippin. Pippin has lost his innocence; and I think more so because of his experience with the late Steward than by Palantir-wrestling with Sauron. Though I have to wonder, is Faramir's pity for Pippin's ordeal and lost innocence totally for Pippin, or tinged with Faramir's own anger and sorrow over his own relationship with his father? I think that Faramir genuinely admires Pippin and regrets the harm done to him by his involvement with Denethor, but Faramir wouldn't be human if there weren't some emotional leakage from his own feelings towards Denethor...I would think that at this point, Faramir's own feelings are too raw for him to deal with them comfortably. And although he's introspective, he's not one to wallow in self-absorption or talk endlessly about those feelings.

I wonder what will happen to Idril after Sauron's defeat...Please update soon!

Author Reply: I find myself rather ambivalent about Idril myself, she does seem to be mostly sharp edges - but then living with Denethor these last years has *not* been fun, his sons could escape to the relative peace of the battlefield but she's been stuck in Minas Tirith running D's household and acting as his hostess.

She is glad Faramir's alive, but that doesn't mean she's going to let him off the hook, she warned him and he didn't listen and she will get in her 'I told you so' if the heavens fall! :D All he has to do is admit she was right and she'll drop it.

And you're right about Faramir's anger at his own treatment getting mixed up with his feelings about Pippin's ordeal. It's going to take both Faramir and Idril a while to forgive Denethor.

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