Selene Aduial
· 28 December 2006
· Chapter 8: Adrift
Eventhough I have no childeren myself I can understand Gilrean's reaction. This is really the beginning of her letting him go and that's difficult for any parent.
Mothwen is probalby right in saying Estel will come home in rags and completely spend. the twins maybe good to and for him, but something tells me they might still have to learn about a young human's limits.
Author's reply
Letting Estel grow up and leave is not going to be easy for Gilraen. He is her lifeline - and without him, she will be wondering about her purpose. She knows, too, what a dangerous world she is preparing him to live in - and how likely it is that he will die before he reaches old age.
Estel will need his mother for a good while yet - which will be a comfort to her - but she will probably have to push to have him be allowed to grow up at the pace suitable for a human child, as elven childhood is so much longer.
Redheredh
· 28 December 2006
· Chapter 8: Adrift
Very touching. Especially the two women, elder and younger, together facing one of the more difficult realities of life.
And, it is not as if this were Gilrean's domain, with her kin taking the boy away with them or her people providing distraction for their queen to other mundane responsibilities. I really wonder if the poor lady knows how to be appreciate an idle moment. No wonder her dilemma strikes so deeply.
Author's reply
Up to this point, everything Gilraen has done in Imladris has been focused around Estel. He won't be gone long - a day at most - but she is not responsible for him. A frightening milestone - because it leaves her wondering what is the point of her life without him. A good moment to find another woman who understands. I think Mothwen will draw Gilraen into the female side of life in Imladris - help her get to know other mothers and widows - people with whom she share experiences that transcend species.
Elrond and his sons do their best - and Elrond, I reckon, understands a great deal more than you would expect - but they are male. Gilraen needs people of her own gender right now.
perelleth
· 28 December 2006
· Chapter 8: Adrift
A fledgling trying his new wings...A rite of passage for the boy, but for the mother as well. Hard as it must have been, it also granted her a moment of interspecies female bonding that was surely welcome.
Author's reply
Tough. And the first time of many - as Gilraen knows only too well. She knows Estel is safe with the twins - he'll get dirty and tired and have a great time - but it's the beginning of their separation. She needs other females who've endured the same thing - and Mothwen is a good example. I hope Gilraen begins to find a role for herself in Imladris, or she is going to be very lonely over the next couple of decades.
Armariel
· 27 December 2006
· Chapter 8: Adrift
Gilraen is a good mother. She has deep feelings but is almost stoical in facing what she must. Which makes it easy to emphasize with her even for a reader without any children of her own! (and must be all the more so for those who do have them!)
Author's reply
She is determined to do what is best for her son. If that means living among Elves, fine. If it means letting him become independent from her, fine. Her role - her sacrifice - is to give up being Gilraen in favour of being Aragorn's mother. Still tough, though. She knows better than most what being Aragorn will demand of her son. But he has to be ready - and good - if he is not to end up failing his people.
daw the minstrel
· 27 December 2006
· Chapter 8: Adrift
I feel Gilraen's pain. I never expected to have to let my kid go off to save the world, but I did have to leave him at kindergarden and college, and even that was hard.
Author's reply
It's tough, wherever and whenever you have to leave them. Mothers really would fight dragons for their kids, given half a chance.
In some ways, I reckon Gilraen might have to push a bit to give Estel the chance to do things, too - which would make it worse. Elven childhood is so much longer, that I doubt whether the elves would have been the ones to suggest that he should move on to the next stages.
harrowcat
· 27 December 2006
· Chapter 8: Adrift
Poor Gilraen! Mere males, of whatever species, cannot understand that cutting apron strings causes wounds that are slow to heal, if they ever do!
Author's reply
It is so painful to let your children go. But necessary. Gilraen might have had to point out at times, too, that Estel was not an elf and that his milestones would come so much more quickly.
She will be lost in Imladris when Estel is busy with lessons and training and developing his independence. It is brave of her not to cling onto his early childhood.
Larner
· 27 December 2006
· Chapter 8: Adrift
Letting ones beloved child go is not easy, but necessary. And how very well you've caught it!
Author's reply
It is so hard to let a child grow up and away from you - especially the 'firsts'. And Gilraen is alone in Imladris - there for Estel - it must have been even harder to let him try his wings. But it has to be done - and she possibly had to push for it at times, too, and insist that he was ready, since elven childhood is so much longer. Thank you.
Agape4Gondor
· 27 December 2006
· Chapter 8: Adrift
What I love most about this story is that it is not the cloyingly sick 'little boy living among Elves' that I usually avoid.... but a really deep understanding tale of a mother out of her element and still growing and surviving.... and the fact that you do make Estel and the twins such fun to read, makes it even better.
I loved the pickle thing - I've got to go find pickles and see if they can do this....
Blessings, and happy holidays,
Agape
Author's reply
Estel is ... a catalyst, really! I think the central figures are more the adults and how they react to the unexpected presence in Imladris of a very young human. It is so hard for Gilraen - hers is a nurturing role and the whole point of that is to prepare a young male to take up a life that is hard and dangerous and will - if her experience is anything to go by - have him find an early grave somewhere in the wild. And the elves are changing, too - they have nurtured many young Dunedain, but this is a child learning who he is rather than an adolescent.
Happy New Year! Have a good start to 2007.
Kitty
· 27 December 2006
· Chapter 8: Adrift
It was, she thought, almost … indecent … that a male – even if he was an elf and old enough to remember the War of Wrath – should be able to see her worries so clearly. Gilraen seems to have no very high opinion of males in general *grin* But what does she expect - this particular male had to survive Elrohir and Elladan as elflings, after all.
Poor Gilraen. It is not easy to let his children go, and I suppose for her it is even more difficult, as she has lost her husband so soon, knows that Aragorn will have a lot of dangerous duties, and as she is living among elves instead of her own people, she will feel the separations even more than usual. I think you caught her feelings very well.
Author's reply
It's a tough situation for Gilraen. She knows that it is her role to nurture and love and let her son go - but she is pretty much alone here in Imladris, without the network of cousins and aunts and so on who would surround her among the Dunedain. She must have wanted to cling on to Aragorn's babyhood as long as she could. I do think she is an amazingly courageous character.
Elrond understands better than she realises - he has been through his own suffering and lost more of his family than she has. But sometimes you don't want to be understood!
Nilmandra
· 26 December 2006
· Chapter 7: Rain
I think of how hard this most of have been for Gilraen - indeed her son needed a father, but in hiding Estel he would never know of his own father. They do what is best for the child, but how hard for Gilraen, all the same.
Author's reply
I think Gilraen must have had a lot of sleepless nights. Nights when she spent hours reliving her memories and trying to hold onto herself as a woman of the Dunedain - Dirhael's daughter and Arathorn's wife - hoping that, one day, she could pass her memories to her son. (Whether he would ever have been ready to hear them, I don't know. Maybe she wrote them down in those years after Estel became Aragorn and before she left Imladris to fade from history.)
Estel was better having a father - especially with Elrond as a father. I think she would have seen that and accepted it. They raised a good son - even if, I reckon, he was more than a little confused as to where he belonged. He rather merits the name 'peredhel' himself.
Nilmandra
· 26 December 2006
· Chapter 6: Tales
Gilraen suddenly found it difficult to breathe. She had come to think of these elves as young – much as everyone else in Imladris did – but they were, of course, nothing of the sort. ‘You knew Aragost?’ she squeaked.
I like the idea that the twins can be young, yet their long years comes out at other times as well. Gilraen is as a child to them too, yet when they play with her son, she becomes the adult and they the young ones.
How sad to think of how much would be forgotten when the elves sailed from Middle-earth forever.
Author's reply
I suppose, in a way, it would show that they were getting used to each other. The twins would probably have shielded her from seeing them as they were at first - knowing that she wasn't ready to cope with that. Yet they can be young with Estel and grown up when he is in bed. And they offer Gilraen the respect due to a mother - while of course, in other ways, looking on her as barely more than a child.
Yes - the end of the elves in Middle-earth would be a very sad time, for many many more reasons than the division of Arwen and Elrond.
Nilmandra
· 26 December 2006
· Chapter 5: Comfort
He could not recall when they had grown too big for the ritual – he just knew that he had missed it when it was no longer part of his life.
That is a nice way of saying that. Many things we don't realize how much we enjoyed until they're gone.
Elrond looked at the smear of black round the child’s mouth and splashed on his tunic. ‘I shall not worry,’ he said brazenly. ‘I am sure Gilraen will know who to blame for his appearance – and, rest assured, it will not be me.’
Another advantage to having E2 so involved - someone to blame!
Author's reply
If only you knew things were happening for the last time, you would cherish them so much more - but you don't, and then you just know it has passed and you will never have it back. Anything to do with kids tends to do that to you! (Of course, when it is something like helping with physics homework, that is a good thing...)
I am sure E2 are more likely to get the blame for anything - after all, would you, in Gilraen's position, have the nerve to accuse Elrond of not supervising Estel properly? No, E2 are there to be the fall guys! (But they have broad shoulders. They'll cope.)
Nilmandra
· 26 December 2006
· Chapter 4: Spice
You post faster than I can keep up, Bodkin!
There is no way any cook can look at small child who wants to make something for his mama and not cave, no matter that Elladan the Terrible is standing nearby. And cook is smart -she now has leverage over E the Terrible too, something she likely never had in the past, LOL.
Author's reply
I got ten written very quickly - and then became so immersed in catering duties that I had no computer time at all. So they will continue to arrive until the New Year, at any rate!
No - the hopeful look in Estel's eyes and Iavas was beaten - and the thought of making Elladan clean up was also probably very enticing. I suspect she was putty in the twins' hands when they were small - I wonder if it was Glorfindel who brought them to make spiced biscuits according to some ancient recipe of Gondolin ... and whether Iavas insisted that he should clean up after the two of them. Could be!
vampfan30
· 26 December 2006
· Chapter 7: Rain
this story just gets better - the idea of them finally melding into a little ( albeit mixed ) family, just too sweet.I have an older brother, but, find myself a tad jealous of Estel 'cause my brother NEVER allowed me such behavior, he ws too busy terrorizing me....^_^
Author's reply
Ah - well that's the advantage of Elrohir having 3000 years on Estel! He is a much older brother who has lived long enough to realise that indulging a little one is a pleasure that doesn't come often. It's a mixed family - Gilraen and Elrond sharing parenting duties for Estel, with the twins playing kid roles (most of the time). But it is a family that works for the intended purpose - Estel will be secure and well-raised and helped to become the best man he can be.
perelleth
· 26 December 2006
· Chapter 7: Rain
Ai! the pleasures of staying late, while it is pouring (or snowing) outside. Even if there is a little Balrogling kicking inadvertently at your most sensitive parts... That part was greatly done, it got me chuckling wickedly. And what a tender moment. I could imagine Elrohir half dozing as the boy recounted his adventures and suddenly "Ada" slips naturally from his lips. A beautifully done moment of realization.
Author's reply
Kids' feet seem to get everywhere. And have more sharp edges than should be possible. Elrohir has learned to protect himself - even when half-asleep.
I think Estel would have slipped into calling Elrond 'Ada' - it wouldn't have been particularly significant to him - but Elrohir would know what it meant to Gilraen. I think she maybe made a mental adjustment of some kind that didn't take paternity away from Arathorn - but she would have known that Estel needed a father. And what better substitute father could he have than Elrond? Under the circumstances.
perelleth
· 26 December 2006
· Chapter 6: Tales
How amusing for the elves to see real life turned into tales! ;-) History decanted into folklore, like mad old Uncle Bilbo who disappeared with a bang and reappeared again! Although to Gilraen surely was shocking! ;-) Really clever take, Bodkin, I loved it!
Author's reply
It would be odd on both sides. The stories would change, I should think - become ... cleaner and less real. Happier. In fact, they might be quite hard, a lot of them, to relate to the real events. While, to Gilraen, to see those she saw every day suddenly become ageless and experienced beyond the capacity of any human to understand would make them suddenly quite alien ...
Thank you, perelleth. I'm glad you liked it!
meckinock
· 25 December 2006
· Chapter 4: Spice
Awww, Bodkin, you're turning me into a Little Estel fan. Who could resist such innocence and cuteness? Not the cook, apparently. I loved Elladan's assessment of Estel's ability to charm, too. And the cook's admiration of Elladan's gentleness and patience with the boy, as well as her satisfaction with the return of gentleness to his hands. Very warm and nice for Christmas.
Author's reply
Little Estel is much sweeter when he isn't centre-stage! It must have been quite an adjustment to those who had lived a child-free existence in Rivendell over centuries - but I imagine elves would have found children delightful. (One the whole.) And seeing E2 revert to playing - that must have been beyond price.
Life might well have become more difficult once Estel had outgrown this very accepting stage of early childhood.
Linda Hoyland
· 25 December 2006
· Chapter 7: Rain
A very touching scene.
Author's reply
Thank you. Elrohir makes an excellent big brother.
Linda Hoyland
· 25 December 2006
· Chapter 6: Tales
It must be very disconcerting to meet walking history !i think you capture Gilraen's feelings very well here.
Author's reply
It's the sort of thing she would know - intellectually - but still, when you actually come up against it, it must feel a bit like being splashed by a very cold wave.
Linda Hoyland
· 25 December 2006
· Chapter 5: Comfort
A moving glimpse into a side of Elrond we don't usually see.It seems ARAgorn is already perfecting his ranger skills !
Author's reply
Elrond would have been a splendid father, I think. Maybe a little too concerned to make all experiences educational, but he would have learned from Celebrian the importance of fun. Estel is reminding him that there is life beyond grief - and he will take delight in having a child looking to him for parenting.
He has a way to go yet, though, before he can successfully sneak his way through Moria.
Linda Hoyland
· 25 December 2006
· Chapter 4: Spice
This brings back lovely memories of my own childhood.I like the way Estel wins hearts even so young.
Author's reply
I think the elves were probably suckers for children - it had been a long time since a child as young as Estel grew up among them and they would have found it difficult to resist his innocence. And spending time cooking - a delight for any child.
Linda Hoyland
· 25 December 2006
· Chapter 3: Admiration
Some nice insights into parenting.I like your Gilraen very much.
Author's reply
Thank you. It's very easy to overlook Gilraen - but she must have had amazing strength of character to raise Aragorn as a man in Imladris.
Kitty
· 25 December 2006
· Chapter 7: Rain
Lovely. Simply lovely. Elrohir not only accepted the interruption graceful but reacted perfect to the boy. And Estel was so trusting.
You're very probably right about the question of fathers among the Dúnedain; many of the children must have grown up without fathers or at least seeing them seldom, and they surely learned a lot from grandfathers or other men. But it was thoughtful of Elrohir to think of Gilraen's feelings first. And what a feeling for Estel to have his adored Elrohir and Elladan as *brothers*!
It's not wonder Estel grew up to be the man he was after he was accepted truly in the family of Elrond and the twins teached him so much.
Author's reply
Elrohir had the sense to realise that the visit was an additional blessing. While Estel is still so young that he hasn't yet accumulated the self-consciousness of an older child.
I do think that - with many of the adult males out patrolling Eriador, even discounting the number who would have died - parenting must have been shared among the community. It still would be hard for Gilraen to hear Estel call Elrond 'Adar', but she would see that it was better for him to have a secure family. And being brothers with the twins would add a certain gleam to it for Estel!
Estel needed a secure childhood very much - considering what he had to face later. Unquestioning love, discipline, guidance, high principles and unquestioning love - vital ingredients in child-rearing. His family - all of them - could be proud of the man he became.
French Pony
· 24 December 2006
· Chapter 7: Rain
[Bogart voice] Ya know, Bodkin, I think this is the beginning of a beautiful friendship. [/Bogart voice]
Author's reply
Goodness - you're good at that Bogart voice!
I reckon it could be exactly that! A mere 18 years or so of E2's lives - plus however much time they were able to spend together after that, and then the post-War years. But sharing childhood builds strong bonds - and then sharing a sister can make them unbreakable.
French Pony
· 24 December 2006
· Chapter 6: Tales
One does tend to forget just how young Gilraen herself was, I think. She's not too far off from the age of being the appreciative audience for stories about Elves and talking animals. Nice that she has the Elves to bring a little wonder back into what would otherwise be a hard, sad life.
Author's reply
Gilraen was very young. Under thirty, I think - which for a long-lived pure-blooded descendant of Numenor is barely out of childhood. I should think the stories are fresh in her mind. I like to think of Elrond and his sons caring for her as carefully as they did Estel - but she would, I think, have been very lonely. Especially as Estel grew and didn't need her so much.