Nilmandra
· 15 September 2004
· Chapter 7: Chapter 7
I read through to the end and couldn't help myself for saying 'damn Noldor' at the end :p
There is something wonderfully ironic about having Celebrimbor discover that others might have thought of his idea before him; Men and Teleri - I mean, how hard must that be to hear? And they might even be farther along than him!
Celeborn's despair is palpable, but I am glad we got to see Galadriel fired up. I believe their great love story did go on, and she's probably about to tackle him and have her way with him. (please? :D). His base instinct likely exists in her too!
Nice detail, as always. I felt like I was there in that workshop.
Author's reply
Thanks for the review, Nilmandra. I'm getting quite a reputation for being anti-Noldor, but well, I guess someone has to do it ;) My Celebrimbor is a genius, but boy does he know it! The idea that other, lesser peoples might have come up with alternative ways of doing this came as a nasty shock to him.
You're quite right, the whole story is something of a clash of their base instincts. She wants him to prove that he cares, he wants her to do the same and neither of them are willing to make the first move. But something's got to give next chapter, (or I'll be lynched ;) ).
Thanks again!
Bodkin
· 15 September 2004
· Chapter 7: Chapter 7
Oh, wonderful. The provocation of Galadriel by Earwen is superb - as she judges just how much to needle her into going to tell Celeborn just what she thinks of him. But then - I got to the end of the chapter and she HADN'T ARRIVED. How long can I endure the waiting?
Poor Celeborn - visiting Finrod and hoping that Galadriel will storm in, in full fury - and being confronted with Celebrimbor: not his favourite elf. It must be unbelievably difficult to have all those ancestors and enemies coming back to haunt you.
Love so many things - the observations on the Noldor High King's family, Celeborn snarling at Celebrimbor, his thoughts on forgiveness: -
'He had wanted to forgive them, take them back into his life. For Celebrimbor his goodwill extended only to the thought that punching him in the teeth would not be worth the split knuckles.'
Elven space travel - and the Noldor whizz-kids needing the Sindar talent. Perhaps working together will help settle all the differences.
NOW BRING GALADRIEL AND CELEBORN TOGETHER! PLEASE! OR THERE WILL BE BLOODSHED. (Galadriel is in a very bad temper and Celeborn is getting too upset.)
This was just fantastic stuff.
Author's reply
Thanks, Bodkin! Earwen's a canny elf who seems to have more idea how to influence her daughter than most people do. I enjoyed getting to know her a bit.
I think you can tell that Celeborn was not exactly at his best, and, like him I wasn't sure whether Celebrimbor, who was responsible for so much heartache (albeit mostly with good intentions) should have got out of Mandos yet. But it's interesting to think that some of Feanor's family might be back by now. That's got to up the tension between the Noldor and the Sindar.
I'm immensely relieved that the space travel didn't put you off the whole fic. I did think it was a bit of a risk. But how can it be a happy ending if they don't have something new and exciting to do?
Besides, it'll take their minds off the misery of not being together any more. (Whoops, did I say that? Sorry ;) ...Nah, you know I wouldn't do that to my favourite elf!)
Thanks again!
Marnie :-)
Ellie
· 10 September 2004
· Chapter 6: Chapter Six
I wish Galadriel would lower her pride and go back to Celeborn. I like the way you portray Finarfin and Earwen in this.
Update soon!
Author's reply
Thanks for the review, Ellie! I don't think it will be giving much away to say that Galadriel will eventually soften towards him - it's just a matter of how and when ;)
Artemis
· 9 September 2004
· Chapter 6: Chapter Six
*sigh* Whether she be Nerwen, or Artanis, or Lady of Lorien, she's still stubborn. Gah. ^^ Lovely chapter- you bring out the natures of the characters so brilliantly!
Author's reply
Thanks, Artemis! Glad you liked the chapter. And Nerwen is strong willed and resolute, of course. No one would dare call her stubborn ;)
Aislynn Crowdaughter
· 8 September 2004
· Chapter 6: Chapter Six
Hi, Marnie!
I am delighted to see a new chapter of this story, that I am still enjoying very much! How devilish of Celeborn to come with such an entourage, and then telling his father in law that he came to see Finrod, not galadriel; it may be a real outrage for Galadriel to hear that! But he knows her well; it may also be just what is needed to break her resolve and peak her curiosity...
But I do not see much hope for their future together, becazuse if celeborn really causes a second exodus, I can hardly see galadriel following him, because she must have been so grateful to be finally aloowed back in the first time around, I can hardly see her risk it. Then again, she *is* the most dstubborn headed and endeavouring female Noldor we know of... so maybe she would follow him again, anyway.
I loved the part about Celeborns questions and thoughts of Elmo, and the discussion concerning the fear of the orcs. It is great to see you bring all these charactzers to life and in focus! Please go on with this story, soon!!!
Aislynn
Author's reply
Thanks for the review Aislynn! Glad you're still enjoying it, and yes it is a little wicked of him, but I think it may work :)
As far as the exodus goes, wait and see ;) I don't think he's planning on a sort of return in force a la Feanor. And I've always worried about those houseless ones and the wandering elves. In a 'happy ever after' story it doesn't feel right to be happy at their expense.
More next week, I hope. Thanks again!
Sulriel
· 8 September 2004
· Chapter 6: Chapter Six
"For I came to see Finrod" ....
Beautiful!! I love the thought of Galadriel's reaction to that tidbit.
Author's reply
LOL! Thanks! I can safely say she's not happy :D
Bodkin
· 8 September 2004
· Chapter 6: Chapter Six
I just feel another craving to say: brilliant, brilliant, Brilliant, BRILLIANT.
Elemmíre
· 8 September 2004
· Chapter 6: Chapter Six
Now that I am on fewer painkillers I can offer more useful comments. :)
>>And - if you would aid me - it should be beneath your banner, with as showy an escort as can be mustered."
When I read this, I was like...uhoh...what is he planning...this is *so* unlike Celeborn!
>>Naturally," Thingol's eyes gleamed with dangerous humour...I will give you such an entourage that his sight will be darkened, from the dazzle. All who see you will conclude that you are the equal of any of his sons. My own pride demands no less."
This whole exchange feels wonderfully in-character. Thingol is prepared to have fun with this.
>> And I will set in motion one or two small projects of my own, which I will ask permission for later; after I am assured they will work.
Celeborn has been independant for a long time...I wonder if he will over-step himself here?
>>...who had cast aside the names they gave her and taken a new, foreign one...
This sounds like a father a bit hurt, a bit bemused...even after ages without him, she still clings to the name he gave her, not the one they did!
>>Few who knew only his daughter's empathic grace, her gentleness and generosity, would suspect the streak of harmful stubbornness in her - the way she clung to hurt, though it all it achieved was to scar her.
Which your stories have always made oh-so-clear! I can't now think of her any other way.
>>Caparisoned in cloth of silver, their unbridled horses snorted, restless, and tossed the gems wound into their manes in flashes of light, as though they had waded through Varda's stars.
What a lovely image!
>>aware that he was instinctively looking for something of which to disapprove
Finarfin the wise is at least aware of it...
>>No one could be worthy of her, least of all this dark elf, youngest of a line of youngest sons, unaware of how ridiculous his display of self importance was making him look.
This is a great line...Galadriel is the youngest child of the last son of Finwë after all...and I love the oh-so-Noldor thinking that its the Umanyar that are self-important, vain-glorious, &c. when it's the Noldor whom the Sindar (and, let's be honest, everyone else) actually regard that way! I mean, this is the Elf whose city is tiled with semi-precious stone...
>>But the banners were still a touch too far. ...But all were now left behind. Dead kingdoms; vanished glory.
I'll grant dragging all your banners along is a little odd...but it ought to serve as a reminder of how strong the Elf he faces is, while Finarfin (in typical, I expect, Amanyar style) disregards them entirely.
>>His purpose is practical - to make it impossible for you to discreetly turn him away. He is not above using whatever weapon comes to hand.
Somehow I suspect it is more than that...it seems too 'surface' a meaning.
>> I too know what it is like, to be left behind by Galadriel.
Ah hah! I'm glad you're showing this as an unexpected link between them.
>>"That may be so." Pointedly, Galadriel returned to her corner seat and took up her work again, keeping her head bent. "But still I do not want to see him."
Galadriel has run out of reasons..."but still I do not want to see him." LOL! Stubborn girl.
>>He moved to stroke the many tight braids of her hair, piled queenly on her head and aggressively pinned with rubies.
aggressively...a nice image
>>Orodreth's deep, soft tones, greeting the new arrival as a friend long missed.
yay for Orodreth!
>>"I am not promising anything," Earwen smoothed her sky-blue sleeves primly, and watched her go with narrowed eyes.
I'm really beginning to like Earwen!
>>And it has been long since she needed our advice."
Somehow I don't think Earwen believes this!
>>Finarfin's problem son-by-marriage bowed with simple courtesy; far more hesitant than his massive entourage had led Finarfin to expect.
An interesting approach...not quite the same as when he approached Fingolfin...
>>Where he had thought to face a wall of Umanyar arrogance, he was taken aback to find something far more familiar.
Again...*Umanyar* arrogance? Only a Noldo...okay, unless he had one too many run-ins with Oropher or Thranduil!
>>This man was all shadow - the moving shade and coolness of trees. One could not see what was going on in his mind, until speech broke the canopy of his thought, startling as a flight of hawks.
Oh lovely lovely image!
>>"I was not left with much choice," he said, annoyed at being thanked for something which he had been forced to do.
score 1 for Celeborn
>>He expected protest; some change at the very least in the shadows of those verdant eyes, so strangely dark. Surprise, surely? But there was nothing, save perhaps the steady interest of a chess player, who sees a long foreseen move played out. His own interest was piqued. Was this a more even match than he had suspected?
Finarfin keeps offering shallow explanations of their marriage–questioning, in much the same way, as his kinsman had done in Beleriand so many years ago! He should know better than to think his daughter would marry any less than an equal...
>>your daughter is as the North Star in my sky - the centre about which my world revolves. But I am not such a fool as to think her a liar. She said she would not see me, therefore she will not. The sight of her would be as rain to me after ten thousand years of drought,
This is so beautiful!
>>For I came to see Finrod."
LOL. Celeborn learned the art of siege well...
:),
Elemmíre
Author's reply
What happened - re the painkillers, I mean? I'm glad to hear you're recovering anyway. Thanks for the review! I was so happy to think that Celeborn's character was so established that his display of pomp was immediately obvious as OOC. As you can see, it was done for a practical purpose, and worked, so hopefully it's not OOC after all, just surprising.
Re Celeborn's private projects, oh yes, they overstep the line in a big way :)
In thinking of Umanyar arrogance Finarfin is thinking of people like Eol and Oropher, even Thingol on his bad days. I think that in the pig headed 'I'm better than you' stakes they could give any Noldo a run for their money!
As far as the banners go, their purpose was mostly just display, but also to remind Galadriel of the long history he and she had together - all the places they ruled together and all of those times. I don't know if I'll be able to get that in to a later chapter, so it's nice to be able to say it here.
I like Orodreth. He's another character who gets abused by the fandom, just because the nutters are more charismatic than he is. He did OK as king of Nargothrond before bloody 'walking disaster' Turin turned up.
My feeling was that Celeborn would be more nervous on meeting Finarfin than on meeting Fingolfin because Finarfin was his father in law, and because he felt himself to be in the wrong in having stayed away so long. Also, because he's there as a private person and not as a representative of his people, he can afford to *look* more nervous than he did with Fingolfin.
Glad you liked Celeborn's unexpected move at the end. I did enjoy doing that :)
Many thanks again!
Marnie :-)
Bodkin
· 8 September 2004
· Chapter 6: Chapter Six
Oh great. I was so happy to come in to this.
I just love Celeborn's sheer intelligence in dealing with the Galadriel situation. Of course he hasn't come with all the pomp and circumstance to see his wife - of course he accepts her word that she won't see him. Of course his sole ambition is to see Finrod.
His resistance to his grandfather's fate is interesting, too - and his concern for the houseless elves remaining in Arda.
I like Finarfin and Earwen - and their slight exasperation with the tantrums of their 20,000 odd year old daughter. Some things never change. Interesting that Finarfin should have some fellow feeling from having been abandoned - and the likeness of Celeborn to Earwen.
I must say I am looking forward to the eventual meeting of Celeborn and Galadriel.
More soon? Please.
Author's reply
Thanks for the review, Bodkin! Of course Celeborn's announcement that he doesn't want to see his wife is not intended to provoke her to such fury that she wants to rush out and tell him where to get off. That would be sneaky and underhanded, and far too low for a noble elf-lord ;) I'm delighted that you see that.
I do feel that someone ought to be concerned about the houseless ones and the orcs, and all those missing characters like Daeron and Maglor, who are doomed to wandering the world. The fact that Celeborn has a family member in such circumstances just makes it easier for him to care.
I think that, given the chance, Finarfin and Celeborn will get on fine - they're very similar. But that rather depends on what Galadriel decides. I'm not looking forward to their meeting, because it's going to be far too complicated!
Thanks ever so much for a great review.
Sphinx
· 8 September 2004
· Chapter 6: Chapter Six
You really do know how to return with a bang. ;)
And you promised me Galadriel. But furniture throwing scene is yet to come. I want to see a furniture throwing scene.
I am not above bribery.
And Melian's -
"You are a hard man to compliment,". Never a truer word said. What a brilliant insight.
*swoon* I think I have returned to shameless fangirlyness. Lack of fanfic and the fandom at large has done this to me.
Celeborn is such a tactician. I think that's what I love most about him, and its something I always try and bring out. And it was such fun to read your version of Finarfin's impressions of him. *big grin*
Sorry about the lack of email, but RL has been insane and full of evil things called assignments.
Do update. :D
Author's reply
Thanks!
I promised Galadriel and I delivered Galadriel, but I'm afraid the furniture throwing scene is likely to take place out of doors, so there won't be any furniture to throw.
I'm glad you liked Melian's words. Celeborn's imperviousness to praise intregues me. As my muse he keeps saying things like 'you're making me too nice, stop it!' or 'not everyone likes me you know - make sure you write down that some people think I'm a jerk.' I find it rather touching, but then I have long been abandoned to swooning shameless fangirliness, and I'm always glad to pass it on ;)
Exactly, he is a tactician - he's shrewd and practical, and that's so rare in elves that it's no wonder he's called 'the wise', the majority of the mystic types like Gildor, Elrond and Galadriel just don't think like that.
I'm glad too that you approved of the meeting with Finarfin, though you've set the standard for that. Did you know yours was praised on HASA recently?
Hope studying gets better! Thanks again.
Layangabi
· 8 September 2004
· Chapter 6: Chapter Six
And with the dawn of September comes the new chapter by Marnie...:)
Sorry I haven't answered your mail yet friend, it's hell month. *-* I'll email you asap, but yeah...
(but of course, chapter 6 came out and I could not resist :D)
I am pleased to see that Celeborn, indeed, is *so* not willing to let the issue with Elmo slide, or indeed, the issue of all their lost kin. *waves Sindarin flag yet again*
(On sidenote, was quite pleased to see one of Oropher's grandchildren or greatchildren running around Valinor...well of course he'd have some around, but hey...:D)
I find it...amusing...that Earwen is rolling her eyes at her daughter, while with Finarfin, Galadriel is still daddy's little girl...o.O heh heh heh But it's nice to see that he's aware of her weaknesses and strength, the kind of person who'd be good for her. Finarfin, meet your son-in-law. :D "I've gone to see Fingon indeed" *snort* Yes, I know that he's on serious business, and he has getting back Galadriel in mind, but if galadriel had been listening by the door, what a way to burst her bubble. XD
Something i'd like to ask about Amdir: *raises hand* When Thingol said most of his folk were Avari I got the impression that he was referring to the Noldor Avari, not "their own kin." Am I right? And if so, how did that happen?
Author's reply
Yes, it's nice to be back in the saddle :) I do hate the holidays! No worries re the email, though I always enjoy getting it.
As far as Elmo goes, I recently put a picture of him up on my site, with the result that I've rather fallen in love with him. Someone needs to rescue him, definately.
Off the record I can definately confirm that that was Legolas' daughter who was dancing with Beleg - I think they may be an item.
Glad you liked Celeborn's sneaky strategy :) It's rather funny to imagine Galadriel's reactionwhen she hears. And as for Amdir, no, I meant that most of his folk were Lindar Avari, from the early days of Lorinand. He has some Noldor avari too - they had spread all the way to Beleriand by the first age, so I think it's reasonable that some might have settled in Lorien.
Anyway, many thanks for the review!
Sphinx
· 24 July 2004
· Chapter 5: Chapter Five
An orc? An orc!!?!?!?
You put Agatha Christie to shame. Cliffhanger skills are brilliant, Marnie.
Remind me to bug you for more of Elladan in the future. ;)
'pologies for the delays - RL has been hectic.
I love Elu in this. The way he comes out in his dressing gown, the way he talks, the way he always seems to be *there*. And...Calandil's back! That should be reason enough to celebrate. I've told you time and again how much I like him.
But Galadriel should enter. Now. And then the fireworks shall begin. :)
Author's reply
My cliffhangers have a tendancy to be like those ones in the old serials at the movies, where you'd end the film with him falling off the cliff and go 'OMG! what happens next!' and then next week go back only to find that he'd had his foot on a ledge all along :)
No more Elladan in this one, I'm afraid. And sadly hardly any more Elu - as you know he's my second favourite elf ever :) Calandil insisted that I couldn't just leave him like that, since everyone else in the world was getting in the fic, and who am I to resist?
I can indeed promise Galadriel next chapter, and Finarfin, and one or two other Noldor. But sadly, now the summer holidays have arrived and my children are at home all day long, the next chapter won't be until September.
Many thanks for the review!
Marnie :-)
Arquen
· 22 July 2004
· Chapter 5: Chapter Five
Just ran across this story last night. This is wonderful! I don't think anyone can write Celeborn the way you do. And I try to immitate the way you write Elves, the way you make them Elves, instead of like some writers who make them seem like only glorified humans. I can't wait to see where this story goes. It is truly intriguing.
Author's reply
Thanks Arquen! Particularly about thinking that my elves are elvish - I do try hard to remember they aren't human :) But don't imitate me! Any success I might have comes through the fact that I imitate Tolkien :) Check out the elvish scenes in The Hobbit for inspiration!
Thanks again!
Marnie :-)
npkedit
· 21 July 2004
· Chapter 5: Chapter Five
I'm new to LOTR fic, but have always been a Celeborn fan and everyone I consulted told me I had to read your stuff. I have not been disappointed. Actually, I'm enthralled.
The comparison of the Elu/Melian and Celeborn/Galadriel relationships is intriguing (and, I think, spot on). I liked Celeborn's initial anger at Melian--struck me as very realistic. And his insight into Melian's difficulties is wonderful--he really is one of the few Sindar elves who could appreciate her position.
And that Elmo stunner at the end...very powerful.
I, for one, am riveted and can't wait to see the next chapter.
Author's reply
Many thanks for the review, npkedit :) It's always a delight to meet another Celeborn fan. I only started to write about him because I wanted to read about him and no one else seemed to be interested. Things have much improved since then - be sure to look up Bodkin, Nilmandra, Bejai, Sphinx, and JastaElf for great stories featuring Celeborn.
Alternatively, visit my site, where I've been collecting good Celeborn stories, and you can find all of the above and more:
http://www.elfringham.dsl.pipex.com/lotrfic/elfportraits.html
A lot of the Third Age elves we meet seem modled on one or other aspect of Elu Thingol - Thranduil has his underground palace by a river, Elrond has his daughter problem, and Celeborn has a similar relationship with his wife :) What this means, I don't know :)
But anyway, I'm sure you didn't expect a lecture in return! Many thanks again,
Marnie :-)
Layangabi
· 21 July 2004
· Chapter 5: Chapter Five
Hooray,hooray, a new chapter of Seeds. :-D What a delightful surprise Marnie. :)
Even with, of course, the nasty shocks. >.< Good *Lord.* I never expected the Higher Powers to be so uppity about the union between an elf and a Maia. What's the matter with them? Good on Aule and Yavanna for cheering T&M on, in their own way, but what's up with the others?
And Elmo...*shudders*. Perhaps we should have guessed when we were told he'd been "taken," but it's a *nasty* shock. (please tell me there are at least some people who just aren't going to let this slide. Celeborn among them.)
You have succeeded, not only in making me feel sorry for, but *horrible* for Melian. Ouch. What would it have been like for her to welcome reembodied kinsmen one after the other, only for them to turn on her.
I find it funny that Celeborn mentions Oropher more than once, and always for his famous temper, lack of tact, and their mutual antipathy. ;)Hehehehe...no, Oropher couldn't be tactful to save his life (why do I have a feeling Celeborn has a bit of nostalgia for this?).
And on a sidenote, I *really* wanna know how, and *why,* in the name of Ea, the Sindar got ahold of that diamond-woven pink tunic. o.O ... (do they go cabaret occasionally?)
Author's reply
Thanks for the review, Layangabi! To be frank, I don't think the Valar seem to be able to agree on anything, so there being some voices who didn't want to take the risk of allowing Elu and Melian to set such a precident, seems inevitable. Suppose it started happening all over the place. What chaos!
No, Celeborn is not just going to let it slip about Elmo, though whether he succeeds in doing anything may be up to the Valar. Melian got off lightly, IMO. I would have been much nastier to her than he was :)
I think you're right about Oropher - Celeborn's actually rather fond of him, though it's hard to tell under their mutual attitude problems. And the tunic... it was a gift. I'm sure it was a gift. Probably from Aegnor or Angrod, at some point when it was the height of fashion.
Hm, but I could see elves really enjoying the cabaret...
Thanks again!
Artemis
· 21 July 2004
· Chapter 5: Chapter Five
Your story is far beyond splendid and moving... I am now going to wander away in a slight daze, speechless as an idiot. ^^ It is not often that I, chatterbox extraordinaire in real life, am struck twittering... >.< Excellent work.
Author's reply
Many thanks for the review, Artemis! I'm glad you're liking it so far. It's all downhill from here though into (gah) romance and science fiction. So I hope the ending doesn't disappoint too much.
Thanks again!
Marnie :-)
Bodkin
· 21 July 2004
· Chapter 5: Chapter Five
Immortality and being re-embodied make things terribly complicated, don't they? I love the way that you show that Melian suffers resentment at having abandoned Doriath, but that Celeborn has a better understanding of her position because of having been married to Galadriel. And I find it only reasonable that the Sindar remain suspicious - and that the natives have no comprehension of it.
Also typical that a mourning Melian seems better than a happy one - and that some would rub their hands in glee over the division between Celeborn and Galadriel.
The eagle is quite insightful - but he must complicate Elladan's life considerably. Do so agree with the 'faster travel, less time' suggestion.
Horrible suggestion that Celeborn's grandfather would have become an orc - it makes the origins of orcs come a bit close to home.
Brilliant.
Author's reply
Immortality and being re-embodied make everything *hideously* complicated :) I keep catching myself and going 'oh no! What about so-and-so...he'll be back by now too, where does he fit in?
I suppose it's my own fault for setting it in the near future, so that there's been time for just about everyone to return, but now I have far more obscure characters than I know what to do with - witness the fact that the dramatic denoument of this chapter turns on a character no-one's ever heard of ;) And I can't think of anything for the characters people actually like, to do.
Aglarhir quite disturbed me with his Nazi suggestions about racial purity - I'm glad to see the back of him!
Many thanks for the review. I think I must have missed a chapter or even two of yours; I'll go and check now.
Marnie :-)
Aislynn Crowdaughter
· 9 July 2004
· Chapter 4: Four
Hi!
This is a wonderful story, and it gets better with every chapter. I love it how you describe Celeborns feelings, his need to heal, the effect the "fading" has and the way his relationship with his old relatives are described. I hope to see more about them, to meet Elrond, and perhaps see if Legolas stays with his father or has fled somewhere else to not endure Thranduils misgivings about the dwarf. Will we meet Oropher in this? and what *does* Glorfindel do, does he stay with a reborn Turgon, or does he choses to stay with Elrond? I'd like to learn more of this troubled paradise of the elves!
I also love your vision of Valinor, the idea that the Sindar, the Ennorian elves, seek (and recieve) an continent of their own to live in because they do not feel at home with the Noldor... *and* with the other Calaquendi, who have never suffered the hardships of Ennor and therefore won't understand how they "Moriquendi" brothers and sisters feel. I also liked the little aside comments about the valar "it would probably be too shocking modern for the Valar to make Aman round" and Thingol not trusting the Valar to prevent another kinslaying (is it *possible* to slay an elf who has compleetet the "fading"? I do not think so!).
But now we find ourselves at the brink of another confrontation between the different elven kins, and in the middle of elven unrest again. Welcome to the politics of Valinor! All the while Celeborn, dreaming of Ennor and feeling guily for leaving it behind, may even find himself tempted into leading his people (the star elves) into another elven rebellion against the Valar and a new exile (tis time of the Sindar), because if those elves need something to do... well, there is much to do for them in Ennor with all the plants and nature desperately in need to be healed and humanity in need to be taught some reaspect for them... (of course, most Sindar and Silvain Elves who finally fled to Valinor to escape Ennor will not want to go back in any case, nor will Celeborn realy want to go back and leave Galadriel behind forever, so perhaps he will *not* come to this conclusion of the problems given).
Anyway, I can't wait to read more! I also understand Galadriels position much better now. I hope they will be together again... and I am curious how this little war of roses between Celeborn and his teperamental wife will develop.
Please write more soon! This is great!
Greetings to you,
Aislynn
Author's reply
Wow, what a great review, Aislynn! Thank you! I seem to be disappointing a lot of people by not having Elrond in here - I just can't figure out a way to bring him in, other than by report. (I wanted Celebrian rather than Elrond to do the greeting because she doesn't get a lot of stories of her own - rather like Celeborn, she's overshadowed by her more famous spouse.) I'm also afraid that I have no plans to bring in Oropher and Legolas - and Gimli is long dead. Glorfindel too is a case of 'decide what you'd like best'.
I seem to have made this story a bit of an obscure-character-fest, and in the process ignored all the more popular players. I can only offer Melian, Finarfin, Finrod, Galadriel and Celebrimbor to come. It continues to amaze me that anyone reads this at all!
I always felt that - with all the elves going to Valinor - there must be something of a population problem by now. And then there was the problem of who was going to be King of the Teleri - Olwe or Elwe? And if not Elwe, then what was he going to do? And the new continent just seemed to solve all those problems :)
I am delighted with your suggestion that Celeborn could lead a new exodus out of Valinor back to Middle-earth, because I don't think he would be happy to just forget it either, particularly now that he's discovered that his people have become such expert terraformers, and could probably do something substantial to help. I think that you at least might be able to take in stride the rather daring things I'm planning to do next with this. Hurray! Thank you again!
Sphinx
· 9 July 2004
· Chapter 4: Four
An interesting chapter. Almost prophetic, in fact. ;) Now, what remains to be seen is if the fireworks will go off when Celeborn meets Galadriel, or the fireworks will be of warring elves.
I don’t like Nimrodel; I never have. Its rather tough to make her likeable, but you’ve made her readable. And I can forget my opinion of her for about ten seconds. In direct contrast, we have Galadriel, who plays a pivotal role in this story as yet, but who hasn’t even appeared. I don’t agree with everything that she’s being portrayed to be – but I suppose that all the verdicts of her have come from people close to Celeborn, and obviously annoyed with her.
But your supreme skill lies in the imagery that you use – and how well it is used to describe Amroth’s house, the fields and the surrounding area. Really gave me a feel of the place. I’m enjoying these different views of Valinor very much indeed.
Am looking forward to the next update. ;)
Author's reply
I don't like Nimrodel either - it's tough to like someone who refuses to marry the man she loves because it's not *safe*, and in her quest for safety precipitates the whole drowning/getting lost disaster. But she fitted herself neatly into a sort of 'more dangerous but less wise' category :)
As for Galadriel, I have no idea why everyone seems to be getting annoyed or upset with her - she has every right to feel hurt that he stayed away from her as long as he possibly could. *He* isn't upset with her - he quite understands that he deserves to be treated like this, and didn't expect anything else.
I'm curious now - how would you prefer her to be? Judging from her behaviour in LotR (taking Frodo and Sam to the Mirror glade in order to make it clear to them *exactly* what she's giving up; singing her lament for Valinor, so that everyone would know how homesick she was) she's not one to keep her own inner turmoil a secret, she seems to like everyone to know about it :)
Anyway, I *am* hoping to have her appear next chapter, so maybe all will be explained then :) I hope so.
Thanks for the review!
Miriel
· 6 July 2004
· Chapter 4: Four
Hi again. :)
Ok, the thing about Galadriel makes sense now...I knew that she used to be called Atanis (I didn't know about Nerwen though) but couldn't figure out why Celeborn would be relieved that she was still Galadriel. Makes sense now. Thank you for explaining it!
Hm, and as I was reading one of your other reviews, I noticed that the reviewer disliked the fact that you put modern earth in Middle Earth. I actually thought that was a nice touch, as I picked out historical events (Oo! The Ice Age!) and such things like that. Each to their own of couse, but I did like reading of that. It's great to make such a connection.
As far as I knew, Amroth was not Celeborn's son. Did I miss something? Or did you just decide that Celeborn needed a son? (Don't get me wrong, if it's a switch from canon I think that it is for the better.) I probably missed something, I've only read LOTR, Hobbit, The Sil, and the first 10 History of M-E.
I liked the eagle. He reminds me of an uppity British snob, with a monacle and a mustache. (I bet the eagle has a British accent too!)
That must be really weird for Celeborn, I mean, after seeing all these people die and going through the grieving process, suddenly, Poof!, they're alive again. Crazy.
Now, for the 'faded' thing, is he like that just when he wants to be, i.e., can he control it, and change back a forth? I remember reading about it in Morgoth's Ring, but I didn't really get how it all worked. (Ahem. That's what happens when you read and watch TV at the same time.)
Another question (sorry)= does Amroth have contact with his mother? Perhaps he could help open up communication...hm...I'm really rooting for Celeborn here. *waves foam finger* Go Celeborn! Get your girl!
Anyway, sorry so many questions. I can't wait to read what you have in store for us! Update soon!
Please?
Author's reply
As far as the modern day thing goes, you can't please everyone, and I'm going to be doing even more risky stuff than that in the last couple of chapters. Fingers crossed for me to pull it off ;)
In 'The History of Galadriel and Celeborn' in the 'Unfinished Tales' it's definately stated that Amroth was Celeborn and Galadriel's son, born to them when they were living in Eriador, by Lake Nenuial. Later on, as Tolkien revised, he seemed to drop that idea, and made Amroth Amdir's son. But he left in LotR Treebeard's greeting to C+G 'A vanimar vanimalion nostari!' 'Oh beautiful ones, parents of beautiful *children*.' So it's definately canonical that they had more than one child.
Rather than invent a second child, I've gone with the earlier theory where Amroth is theirs. But I tried to reconcile it to the later theory by having Amdir *adopt* and rename the boy. That's *not* a canonical idea, but it was a way to get both versions of the backstory in at once ;)
My understanding of the 'faded' thing is that Celeborn is now naturally invisible. If he isn't thinking about it and making an effort to appear visible, then he is invisible. But he can become visible whenever he choses to.
And Amroth and Celebrian have probably grown up knowing that there's not much they can do when their mother's in *that* kind of a mood, other than wait until their father talks her round :)
More wierdness next chapter . Thanks for the questions, it makes me feel useful :)
Miriel
· 6 July 2004
· Chapter 4: Four
I'm really enjoying this story. It's very intruiging. I really like reading about Celeborn, you never hear that much about him. I can not wait to see him try to court Galadriel...could you make known to us readers the significance of her using the name 'Galadriel' as opposed to another name?
Update soon!
Author's reply
Many thanks for the review, Miriel! Yes, I started writing about Celeborn because no one else was doing it, and I really wanted to read about him ;)
As far as Galadriel goes - when she was born she was named Nerwen and Artanis by her parents. It was Celeborn who gave her the name 'Galadriel'. As Tolkien puts it 'this, the most beautiful of her names, was given to her by her lover...' If she really wanted to have nothing more to do with him, she would probably have told everyone to stop calling her by his pet name :)
I wonder if I should put that in as a footnote..
Thanks again!
Marnie :-)
Amaniel
· 5 July 2004
· Chapter 3: Three
I enjoy your stories immensely, and I can tell that you work extremely hard on perfecting them. It shows in your attention to detail and impressive writing style. I usually do not have a problem with the way a writer portrays their own conclusions from Tolkien's work, and I normally agree with your interpretation. I do, however, have difficultly connecting your idea of the direction Middle Earth took to the focus of Tolkien. It kind of hurts the story a little in the way it connects to the real world. One of the reasons I enjoy reading these stories is the fact that they are in no way connected to the thoughtless destruction and stupidity of our own world. I have no problem with you inserting your opinions in the story, after all, it is your work, but I just wanted to let you know my reason for the sudden jolt out of your story. It seemed to injure the rest of the story for some reason. Do not take my comments as negative criticism. Again, I love reading your stories, and I am looking forward to reading the rest.
Author's reply
Many thanks for the review, Amaniel! I'm sorry this one doesn't work for you - I can understand what you mean about keeping Middle-earth out of the stupidities of our own world. :)
On the other hand there are several places in Tolkien's work where he did deliberately tie his stories in to our own world. (I'm thinking in particular of the bit in LotR when Frodo sees Galadriel as present, yet remote *as, at times, elves still are seen*). My feelings are that (a) I like to think it was/is all real, and (b) that not *all* the enchantment has quite left us even now; that somewhere still, even among our post-industrial hills, there may still be quendi lingering. Invisible, aloof, but still there.
Thats why I like to tie in Modern earth with Middle-earth :) But I can understand you not feeling the same. It's an interesting point. Thank you!
Raksha The Demon
· 5 July 2004
· Chapter 4: Four
A fascinating look at Elven familial relationships, and culture in the Blessed Realm. I didn't know that elves who died in Middle-earth would return to Valinor.
You've outdone Tolkien in bringing out the interesting qualities of Celeborn, Galadriel's wise but quiet husband. I find myself looking forward to their reunion. And hoping we will see Gandalf/Olorin again.
Celeborn must have stayed in "Ennor" many thousands of years...Can everyone just reconnect with him after what, 10 millenia?
Author's reply
Thanks for the review, Raksha! I think the eventual decision on the rebirth process was that all elves who died were called to the Halls of Mandos, and there, eventually, they were re-housed. But that was in Valinor. Certainly it says somewhere that Finrod 'now walks with his father' in Valinor, and Glorfindel came back from there.
(I think there was an earlier conception that elves were reincarnated, and that presumably could occur in Middle-earth. But the bit of canon that I'm using for this is LaCE - where, if you don't go to Mandos (ie Valinor) you end up floating around as a houseless spirit for the rest of time.)
I admit you have to look very hard indeed to find out much about Celeborn from Tolkien! I hope though, that I've extrapolated from what's there, and not Mary Sue'd him too much.
I hadn't thought of having Gandalf in there. I have a bit of a mental block about writing him. But I'll turn the idea over and see if I can fit him in somewhere. And you're right, everyone *thinks* they're taking up with Celeborn from where they left off, but he's got rather more going on in his head than they realize, due to 10 millenia of living with Men, and it's going to take a long time before everyone's really caught up.
Goodness! Why have I written an essay? Sorry! and thanks again :)
Bodkin
· 5 July 2004
· Chapter 4: Four
This is just so good. The whole thing - characters, setting, problems. Amazing.
I think I'll give up.
Author's reply
That's what I thought when I saw yours.
(I moved this over here from FF.net, because various people told me that they hated FF.net and would prefer to read it elsewhere.)
But - after a long while of wondering whether it was worth me continuing, as yours was better - I decided that the two stories were so unalike that it was great to have both. I am guessing that yours isn't going to be having the spaceships, and mine is unfortunately not having Glorfindel, Elrond and Haldir; so we're OK :)