Reviews (67)

Primsong · 15 January 2006 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Thank you for taking the time to research and write this all out - what a treasure of information you have assembled, and I wholeheartedly agree with you that he all too often gets the short end of the stick in many a fan-written tale. Well done!

Levade · 16 December 2005 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

I wish I had read this when I first became a fan. It would have cleared up so many things. I was introduced to the fandom by a friend who had been involved in it since she was a child and I naturally thought she had to know so much. She did, but she had a lot of biases that it's taken me a while to work out by going back to canon and sorting through it all myself. Thranduil was one of her "big bads". I don't know why, she won't be convinced otherwise, and argues about what is "canon". Ah well...I'll email her this essay but basically she plays fast and loose with canon. Thanks for so many sources, and being so logical. I admire people's passion, but when it comes to arguing a point, I'd rather be presented with fact rather than fervor. It goes a lot further to prove a point with me. I think of all the time I ignorantly thought wrongly of Thranduil and it makes me a little mad -- at her and myself for relying on another person. I've not bashed him myself, and never will now. The harder part will be learning to like a character I had first been told so many wrong things, but you've definitely helped in that. Too bad they couldn't have put him in the movie in an accurate role -- seeing is believing for many people.

phoenix23531 · 17 February 2005 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Thank you Thank You Thank you Thank You Thank You!!! May I simply offer my sincere thanks for this piece. I love Tolkien's works and fanfiction as it extends Tolkien's realms. Yet I also have a long-held dislike of the growing Evil!Thranduil section of Tolkien fanfiction, and by extension the Evil!WithoutJustification genre. You essay so clearly and succinctly states the primary reasons against this terrible affront to one of Tolkien's (regrettably) more vague characters. Of your many points, I truly loved your arguments regarding the dwarves' sentancing, (which always smacked of a parent sending an errant child to their room). Hardly malevolent, if perhaps somewhat hotheaded (and understandably so). I had not considered the specific sentance of leaving Thorin and his band imprisoned for an hundred years, and am grateful you raised it. Besides, what is an hundred years to an elf? (Though I'm sure, Thranduil did not sentance them so either flippantly or without regard to their mortality.) As for the argument regarding the "cruelty" of their imprisonment: Your reasoning in this regard could not be more valid. Furthermore, the elves in Mirkwood lived in caves, albeit well light and airy ones. It would be only too prudent to have storerooms and cells (even as a deterrant) in the lowest levels, to keep upper levels (and thereby the more airy rooms closest to the trees and stars) for residence. Where else would these Evil!Thranduil authors have the dwarves sent? Thranduil's own chambers? (Though that would have given more credence to some of the more debased writings...shudder!) Finally, I love that you present these arguments with a tremendous mix of tongue-in-cheek and outright humour. I have seen too many essays that were either dry and academic, or else demeaning or excessively aggressive. With appreciation and another string of thanks! phoenix23531

Aerida · 28 December 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Finnally someone had the guts to point out that he is not evil. Thank you so much. Really well written.

Autumn Wanderer · 9 December 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Thank you! I am quite glad that someone is willing to stand up and denounce slash and smut, and can only hope more will do so. Your arguments are wonderful, and I particularly appreciate those which concern elven family life. They are a wonderful counter to all the assorted bad reputations tacked on various elves. I only discovered Lord of the Rings fanfic quite recently, and though I have thoroughly enjoyed much of what I have read, I must admit to being quite dismayed at the amount of slash and smut which goes on. I had expected more the elves-are-sissys attitude, which oddly enough I have encountered only once, but not this! Thank goodness for people like you. If it were not for slash-free sites like this one, I would be afraid to read fanfic. I could keep going, but I think everyone has already said it before in the reviews. Once again, thank you for a delightfully accurate portrayal of Thranduil and elves in general.

Rochwen · 14 August 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Madam Coriel, I must remark upon the surprising amount of research you have presented in this piece. Had you read all of those works previously, and happened to remember a sentence or two about Thranduil, or did you have to read each and every book, simply looking for information? Either way, you are deserving of my deep respect. I must admit; I am very much biased. Thranduil has long been one of my favorite characters, based solely upon the random sentences found throughout Tolkien. I love the combination of wisdom and humor found in any of his quotes. Tolkien presented him as a honorable and steadfast elf, and I am glad that someone (besides myself) remembers that. One question: Where did you find "Morgoth's Ring"? I've never heard of any such tale, and I thought that I had read most of his books. Even in "Unfinished Tales" or "Lost Tales" there has been no mention of any such thing. Keep up the magnificent writing, Your Humble Servant, Rochwen

Amanalda · 4 August 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Ok...now I'm amazed. That was an amazing piece of work that to be quite frank I don't think I'll ever get over...You're points were so increadiably well argued and all the different parts of the Evil!Thranduil that you addressed were just astounding. I think you just beat the Evil!Thranduil into the dust at a gillion miles an hour and I don't think that abomination will be getting up any time soon... You just wait till I get onto e-mail...I'm going to get my friends to read this if it's the last thing I do. I've been trying to convince them for forever that Thranduil really isn't a tyrant and an abusive father. That is just so wrong...like you just proved. hehe. They are going to eat those words faster than you can drink water when you're thirsty... Thranduil has always been one of my absolute favorite characters. I don't know why, but there's this depth to him and his character, as well as his situation, backround and realm that I just love. Like you said he was rather neglected in Tolkien's works, bit still at least we can know a little about him...if we can only RESPECT him for what he truly IS!! Erg it's irritating... But then again, so are mary-sue's, slash and the other abominations to Tolkien's Middle Earth. People can just be so sick sometimes and the world around me is really making me want to throw up...I liked the bit you stuck in there about religion though. hehe. I totally agree with you on that aspect and I'm very glad you brought it up. It really did play a part. Your theory on Thranduil's backround and the fact that he just kept moving and moving and moving really got me thinking. I mean, it really is possible, and if it is is it really does explain a lot. That poor elf has been through hell...moving around like mad, losing his father and two thirds of his army, having to deal with a realm that is slowly becoming overrun by shadow, and then losing his wife to the Sea.(that is my personal belief, I just don't know when...) Ouch. Poor Thranduil. Gotta love him. *grin* Man you are a deep thinker...I'm just really glad that you got into this and went for it. This must have been a big project but I bet it was fun. :) The ending part of your essay I thought was just wonderful. Thranduil did hang in there and they ended up surviving and reaping the benifits...oh man now I'm gonna cry. I just think that is so awesome because like you said, Thranduil had to survive without an Elven ring and he had Dul Guldor to deal with! Man...long live the Elven-king! I liked the arguement you put in with Legolas too. "Legolas greenleaf long under tree in joy thou hast lived...". Absolutely wonderful point and another piece of proof that he was not abused. And the part you stuck with the Aragorn/Legolas friendship thing was really a very good point and quite unexpected on my part. Oh my goodness and the point with the dwarves and that you can't necissarily trust what they say...HA!! What an amazing point. That one had me gaping at the screen for a few minutes. If that is actually true, Tolkien...man what a writer. But you are so right, and the part with Thingol actually being the Elvenking talked about not only shocked me out of my mind but made perfect sense. Go Coriel you rock! Ok, another one of the things that I never thought about that you brought up was the subject of Elladan and Elrohir being these little 'mischief-mongers' as you put them. I'm a little shaky as to my belief as I've never known them any other way, but if you really think about it...hm. I don't know. I'll have to think about it some more. I guess this whole thing with Harry Potter and the Weasley twins and the belief I've seen around a lot that twins are usually mischief makers fed that a lot in writers and that's why it was accepted so easily...along with several other things but that's a very interesting thing to think about... Homeschool graduate are you? Go homeschoolers! :) I'm also homeschooled and finishing highschool, oldest of eight. I salute you Coriel, you are an exeptional writer and are quite a genious from the sound of it...I can only imagine what you're like in college. Whoo! Keep it up, I look forward to reading the rest of your work. May the rest of the Evil!Thranduil followers and writers see the truth and the Evil!Thranduil bite the dust and the real Thranduil take his place. ~Amanalda~

redsquirrel · 26 June 2004 · Chapter 0: True Colors

I had not idea that this was posted on here. First of all THANK YOU! I am so grateful to you for posting this. I have no idea why people insist on making poor Thranduil such an evil, cruel and sadistic person. I am certain that he loved Legolas and was not abusive in the sick ways that I have read in some fan fiction. You deserve to be comended for writing this, something that should have been doen long ago! Great job!!! :-)

Arandil13 · 12 May 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

I always kind of liked Thranduil, and I was so pleased when I read your essay. I never pictured him as a warm, loving nurturer, but that would probably only have been in the best interest of his child (children?) and his realm. If you are in a kingdom at war, you don't want your boy (boys?) to grow up soft and coddled, and you need to be strong for your kingdom. I cannot list here the points you made that I agreed with, because I found myself nodding in agreement the whole time. I loved that you brought up Feanor. Everybody -loves- Feanor, and he was, in my opinion, the closest to Evil! that any of Tolkien's elves came. (Don't get me wrong, I adore Feanor - I think its that whole bad-boy thing he's got going on - but I agree with you. The stuff he did far surpasses anything Thranduil would probably even dream of doing.) I first heard of Evil!Thranduil in the OFUM by Camilla Sandman (a parody, if you haven't heard of it, and she was making some points similar to those that you have). I was shocked. Honestly, I never thought anything he had done would classify him as "evil." I mean, he -did- raise Legolas. I loved the point you made about "in joy thou hast lived," and that an Evil!Parent would not make your childhood all that joyous. I mean seriously people, abuse and incest? From an Elf? I, too, cannot stand slash, but I generally keep my mouth shut about it. I mean, who am I to talk in the first place? I dropped a girl into Middle Earth. *hide* (The only redeeming thing about my story is that she was 26 and I used spell-check and a beta reader.) So anyway, thank you so much for this essay. I am definitely going to recommend it to lots of people! -Arandil

Anonymous · 7 May 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

AMEN, Sistah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Your collection of essays should be required reading for ALL LOTR fanfic writers... including (in fact, I'd go so far as to say:"especially") those who have developed thier own fan fic following and seem to be able to do no wrong in the eyes of their readers. Writers, who, while eloquent and talented in thier own right, still seem to blatently ignore all that is truly canon about the descendents of Oropher. You know, I'm sure of what I speak.. Thranduil who ABHORES the very thought of Gimli. Thranduil who can't keep his paws off of the Dorwinion. Thranduil who can't relate enugh to his son to so much as pat him on the shoulder and say, "nice shot, son!" And those are the most innocent of these non-canon-"Thrandys"! So, needless to say, I have been reading your stories with delight! It is so refreshing to find a truly "ELVISH" Thranduil. Not a pretty "human" king with a silken cascade of golden hair and pointed ears, and about three thousand years of animosity under his oh-so-slim and trim belt...(or, my, my, is that his son?) but an elvish character, based on Tolkien's writings. The most troubling aspect of this "fan-on" is those writers who are too lazy to read the books, and treat EVIL!Thranduil (I love that) as canon (I just read an otherwise wonderful story that had Thranduil as a bit of a drunk, and the writer admidts to having only watched 2 of the movies... fan-on lives!) Enough of this.. but I do love this work and I'm sending the URL to every fanfic writer I know, or at least read! Thanks!

Wren · 30 April 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Wow. That was incredible. I have read a number of anti Evil!Thranduil articles, but your's is by far the greatest. You have so much proof, write with such eloquence and confidence, and cover everything so well that there's not a hole in your argument. All of your points come straight from the book, in a way that cannot be argued. You have truly made great strides toward a greater LOTR fanfiction community.

nessie6 · 24 April 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

You are absolutely right! Thranduil deserves better treatment from fanfiction writers. There was nothing that indicated he was a cruel Elf, and you have a lot of proof against that. He even named Bilbo "Elf-friend" and Elves don't usually hand out that name to just random mortals. I love how great authors such as Thundera Tiger, Jocelyn, and daw the minstrel portray him, because they write him as a loving father, but that he also has a duty to his kingdom. He might get irritated quicker than other Elven lords because, well, his whole realm is getting eaten up by the Shadow, yet it is Lorien that is closer to Dol Guldor and is doing much better than Mirkwood. The poor Elf's probably frustrated! I've only read The Hobbit, LotR, and am only halfway done with The Silmarillion, but I see that he's not cruel, as even some people who have read all of Tolkien's work portrays him as an abusive father and a rapist! But I see Thranduil as a very powerful and intimidating leader. That's what draws me to him, because he has easily become one of my favorite characters. Sure he has a soft spot for jewels, but it said in The Hobbit that he had less jewels than other Elven rulers. This was good, I knew Thranduil to be kind and not evil already, but I wanted to see what you had down to prove that was those things, and you had a lot of information. Note that Bilbo was in the company of dwarves in The Hobbit, and thus, the Elvenking's characters seems a little...harsh. I regret that Tolkien never wrote much more about him, since he's a complicated and very fascinating character. But I'm sure Tolkien never intended Thranduil to be misunderstood as this ruthless, demon Elf. Good essay, and I hope you convinced at least some people!

Ms. Whatsit · 13 April 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

YES! *Thank* you for writing this. I love good old stubborn Thranduil, and I'm *sick* of reading fic upon fic where he beats or sexually abuses Legolas, or even just makes his life a living hell by being nasty, and froths at the mouth about dwarves and Men and the Noldor. Even good authors have him throwing a huge and undignified tantrum over Legolas's friendship with Gimli and refusing to speak with him afterwards. Really, Thranduil lets Legolas go off to fix up Ithilien with a whole bunch of Elves even though Greenwood was just devastated by a war and probably needed rebuilding--he seems a pretty understanding father!

KC · 2 April 2004 · Chapter 3: Thranduil the Great

Im quite glad that someone has put forward the case for Thranduil not being the monster that alot of people seem to think he is. While its perfectly fine to portray characters any way you want in fanficiton, I personally dont enjoy reading stories where Thranduil is written as nasty and abusive just because he appeared unfriendly to the dwarves in the Hobbit. I think its really cool how you have gone to the actual texts to show what type of character Thranduil is and hopefully you have changed a few peoples minds about him!! :-)

Tinnuial · 25 February 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Thank you for this amazing essay on Thranduil. The poor fellow is so terribly misunderstood. It gladdens my heart to see him defended so eloquently. When they finally get round to making "The Hobbit", I hope they make this essay required reading before they start scripting!!! :) Thank you again!

fadagaski · 23 February 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Thank you so much for that essay. I personally find Elves difficult to even comprehend, much less write, which is why I prefer the Mirkwood Elves - they're more human than those of Imladris and Lothlorien, simply because of their attitude to life (ie. laugh now, because you'll die later). Your essay on Thranduil not only explained his character in a way I can understand (leaving out the archaic language that so distinguishes Tolkien), but also shared insight into the minds of Elves in general, particularly the Mirkwood variety. Any author - Elf-styled or otherwise - would be wise to read this for the clever, canon-backed arguments on Elven disposition. Already I have recommended it to another author, who happens to find the character of Legolas annoyingly difficult to work with. Again, many thanks!

fan81981 · 14 February 2004 · Chapter 5: A Dwarf's-Eye View?

I have always viewed the Hobbit with suspicion when it comes to the interpretation of the elves. Having read history I completely agree with your point that the account was probably coloured. In fact, if you think about the fact that elves are immortal and possibly Thranduil was alive when Doriath fell then you have a added reason for his "animosity". He/the elves saw the dwarven treachery. The dwarves might forget but the elves went through it all. It must have been harder for them to be as understanding. For me, the dwarves had about 6000 years to get over non-payment. It happened in their history, unlike for the elves. Cosnidering that they didn't, makes me wonder, how rigid are they?

fan81981 · 14 February 2004 · Chapter 4: Silver and White Gems

This is the second time I am reading this and was going to review at the end but I just wanted to pick up on something. "As financially possessive as he is rumored to be, Thranduil is NOT the greedy grasping miser some portray. " Now I don't remember the Hobbit TOO well, but I thought Thranduil was "fond" of jewels? When has that become finaccially possesive? I like jewellery, a lot - but I will bop someone on the head if they call me stingy/miserly. I think Thranduil would too. :)

Morrigan · 13 February 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Wonderful essay! I congratulate you for that. I too hate the way many fanfics characterize Thranduil. I don’t think Tolkien ever thought of him like the monster these people write. I have no idea how people could think so low of this character. I loved Thranduil in ‘The Hobbit’ and I never saw him as the greedy and unfair king everyone portrays. I agree with you 99% in everything. The other 1% is for something that I somewhat disagree with you. In ‘The Hobbit’ I don’t think he ever did want anything with that treasure, except give it to the humans, who had a right to it. Or did he? I could be mistaken, my memory might trick me or it can be some misunderstanding in translation (I read it translated into Portuguese). Now now… you certainly made me want to read it again! I totally agree with you that the book was made in a dwarven point of view and that Thranduil made nothing wrong, that everything he did was not only his right but also his duty to protect his people. Actually, The Hobbit made me hate the dwarves. THEY were the greedy bastards that had nothing more on their heads than thoughts of jewels and gold. Actually, they did almost nothing. Bilbo did everything, and it was he and Bard who killed the dragon while the dwarves were hiding in a hole on the ground. So they weren’t only greedy but also cowards!! Thranduil, having no part on the destruction of the city of the humans, helped them without thinking twice or demanding anything. The dwarves, whose expedition woke the dragons wrath and made it ruin the human city, refused to give what the dragon stole from the humans. Their behavior after the dragon was killed was disgusting. If not for Bilbo, they wouldn’t even be alive and they acted like they killed the dragon. I really cant understand why people always make Thranduil look like a villain and make the dwarves look like courageous and rightful, like victims or (even worse) heroes in the story! In relation to Tolkien… I’ve read many times that he loved nature and despised the so called progress. The One Ring is, including, an analogy to that. To the destruction of nature by technology. I think Peter Jackson passed this message pretty well on his movies, specially on The Two Towers. Just remember Treebeard talking about Sarumans change of behavior towards nature, Saruman saying that a new age of technology was coming, Saruman destroying the forest, his “orc factory” J, the march of the ents, etc… I didnt read all of Tolkiens books (yet) and I might be mistaken but I thought that, because of that way of thinking, that he should like the sindar and silvan elves more than the noldor. He always portrays the noldor as avid for knowledge and technology, something that he condemned in real life. And it seems that all the elves that turned to darkness (or at least the worse of them) were noldor. So saying I think that he would prefer the sindar and silvan and would never write Thranduil like a villain. Unfortunately Tolkien wrote so few about them…that is contradictory to what I said here, except if he really preferred to show the flaws and sins. Well… you really wrote everything that I also had stuck on my throat (so to speak) and couldn’t get out. Wonderfully done!!! I also would like to express my repulsion not only to evil Thranduil fics but also to all that garbage that people write. It seems that 90% of fanfictions out there fall on one of 3 categories: (1) the so called mary-sues where immature girls see themselves marrying Legolas, specially the girls-falling-on-middle-earth category (giving up immortality is a must); (2) the work of some people with real psychopath and/or sadists tendencies that love to write/read about grotesque torture of loved characters, specially Legolas (rape is a must) or (3) slash. How I hate all of them!!!!!! And to that I would like to praise this site that filters the great majority of that trash! Congratulations!!!!!

Nikara · 13 February 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Wow! That was an awesome argument. I completely agree. Wonderful job with this. I'm very glad that it has been written. I wish that new authors had this as required reading(along with actually reading the books in the first place!)

lembas7 · 13 February 2004 · Chapter 1: Fatherhood

Thank you, thank you, thank you. YES. Finally, a site i can log as having true Tolkien basis to offset all those who claim that there is slash, smut, and other disgustingly distasteful junk rampant in LOTR and associated works. There are many crass, vulgar and simply bigoted people in the world who enjoy the perversion of such a wonderful story. Fanfiction is repusively rampant (please excuse the "matching phrases" as it were) with such trash. Thank you so much for creating this story - the support for your argument in undeniable, and I support you 100% in this view. Thank you so much for writing this.

Yivanethe · 13 February 2004 · Chapter 6: In My Realm Without Leave

I'd like to make a short comment in support of your oppinion here: Atleast 2 warnings (involving elven arrows ; ) were given by Haldir and his brothers to the Fellowship when the entered Lorien. To some, they were more like jokes, but they did scare Sam and convince Gimli to comply, so its really a matter of interpretation. Eomer and his Eorlingas nearly speared Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli for being in Rohan with out permission. Tree-beard considered crushing Merry and Pippin in two, thinking they were orc spies, when they come to Fangorn. Denethor is....well, Denethor in Gondor. Kings, stewards, marchwardens, and various relations will be like that.

Lera · 13 February 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

That was a really well written and enjoyable read. I had actually always agreed that Thranduil was not Evil. There was never any evidence for it, and your essay just laid it all out.

Karri · 13 February 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Nicely argued! :-) (Pale in comparison to the other reviews. Sorry 'bout that. :-/)

LOTR lover · 13 February 2004 · Chapter 10: At the End of All Things

Brava! A most well-written and well-researched piece. When I saw the essay had 11 chapters I was a bit hesitant on starting to read, but I was greatly rewarded. Thranduil is one of my favorite Tolkien characters, and I certainly have no idea where in the Professor's writings the Evil!Thranduil concept could have arisen. Talk about slander!